--Me (probably)
"I hit it with my axe! Wooo!!"
--Youngest mini-Red, in our 2-3x annual 1e AD&D game, as she in turn high fived one of our fellow party members. Yes, both women play Dwarven Fighters. Are you surprised?
If you listen to people talk about Retail WoW after having been away for a while* you can get absolutely lost in all of the systems and designs in the modern game.
You don't say.... |
Returning to Classic WoW as a refuge from the complexity is an illusion, as those devoted to the min/max culture brought that back with them to Classic where it has morphed into its own culture in the Wrath Classic servers.**
Every time I think about trying out Retail, I read some blog posts or watch a YouTube video and --story complaints notwithstanding-- I get lost when people start talking about the various systems in game. When I also realize that unless I want to pay Blizzard extra money I'd have to go through Battle for Azeroth and Shadowlands to get to Dragonflight, I just kind of shudder at all of the complexity those two expacs introduced.
If you've been playing the game straight through, that's one thing. After all, the systems and whatnot are gradually added over time. It's when you go away for years and then come back do you realize just how crazy things have gotten.
***
There was a time when I was the one who preferred the complex over the "easy to learn and hard to master" method of game design. Back in the early 90s, when I was knee deep in games such as Squad Leader, War and Peace, and Battle of the Bulge, an old high school acquaintance invited me to playtest a boardgame he and some mutual acquaintances were working on.
This was the sort of thing that I played back then, which is Victory Games' Ambush!, a solitaire WW2 wargame. From Jonathan Arnold of Board Game Geek. |
Their game was set in the Star Trek universe, where up to three players were fighting over control of a specific doohickey using several starships each. The three factions --Federation, Klingons, and Romulans***-- were pretty much equal in overall strength and movement.
"Is this like Star Fleet Battles?" I asked.
"No," my friend replied. "That's too complex. We're aiming more for Axis and Allies."
Okay, I thought. Let's give it a try.
The game had potential, but I felt that they lost something with the rules as simple as they were. "The various ships with their number rating is fine," I began, "but have you thought about two numbers, one for attack and one for defense? That'll allow you to have more and different types of starships out there."
"We're not doing any of that Avalon Hill bullshit," one of the team snapped back at me. "That crap is too hard and we want this to get a wide audience."
After that, I realized that they weren't really planning on taking my advice to heart, so I just kept it basic with some generally positive feedback and then found an excuse to leave rather early.
The irony is that not only am I the one who prefers simple systems to more complex ones these days, the so-called "simple systems" found in WoW's Classic Era are far more complex than what I proposed back then. Computers have a habit of condensing complexity to manageable levels, after all.
***
Kirk: Galloping about the cosmos is a game for the young, Doctor.
Uhura: Now what is THAT supposed to mean?
Uhura: Now what is THAT supposed to mean?
--From Star Trek 2: The Wrath of Khan
That's not to say that complexity is bad by any means. If you know going in how complex things are, and if said complexity is presented well, the complexity isn't necessarily a problem. The thing is, if complexity is gradually added to over the course of years, you may not realize just how complex things had gotten until said complexity becomes overwhelming.
Or in my case, poking my nose into World of Warcraft after a decade away.
I like to use the Blood Elf starting areas up to and including The Ghostlands as a great way to introduce someone into the various systems of WoW --well, TBC-era WoW-- in a gradual fashion. The build up includes things such as timed events, escort quests, mobs with AoE damage, mobs that chain pull, and mobs that drop the "don't stand in the bad" stuff. In the end, you even have opportunities for grouping up for the two abomination elites as well as Dar'Khan Drathir, but along with everything else that got nerfed in Cataclysm those grouping opportunities were obliterated as well.**** That basic introduction carried my original toons all the way up to max level in original Wrath of the Lich King, because that foundation was utilized and built upon from the beginning.
From what I've read, the brand new intro zone provided in Shadowlands (Exile's Reach) does a great job of providing a new player a way of learning the basics of WoW, but what ends up happening is that those basics get thrown out the window once you reach high enough level to hit the various expansions.
Not that people can't utilize the basics of "don't stand in the bad", but that you're not exposed to the systems found in the expacs until you reach those expacs.
Like, oh, say, Legion.
Or Shadowlands.
Or even Dragonflight.
Existing players may not notice it at all, or may even think it a new quirk of the current expansion, but players who had been away for years --or are new-- will notice. That wasn't always the case, as the systems found in TBC Classic and Wrath Classic --flying and membership in Scryers/Aldor being the notable exceptions-- are also found in Vanilla Classic.*****
After a while, all that bait-and-switch complexity just blurs together and makes you feel like an idiot for not understanding it all. If that doesn't happen on its own, the loudmouth toxic aspects of the WoW community certainly will do that for you.
"LOL L2P noob!" From Memebase via Pinterest. |
***
The thing is, sometimes all you want to do is hit an enemy with your axe. Which brings me to Diablo 4.
I'm moderately interested in Diablo 4, but to my mind as someone who never played the Diablo franchise I'd first want to play Diablo 2# and then 3 before finally setting my foot into Diablo 4.
If that sounds vaguely familiar to long time readers of the blog, that's the process I used to approach Retail WoW with, starting in Cataclysm. I'd select a toon or two and then level those new toon(s) from L1 all the way to max level when the new expansion dropped. This meant that the crowd had already cleared to max level, begun their raiding, and were sitting in Trade Chat complaining that they were bored before I even killed my first mob in the new areas. It also gave me a chance to experience the game as it was presented, whether that presentation was purposely intended or not.
In the case of Diablo, I'm not one to replay RPGs ad nauseum --because replaying and releveling to the end at increased difficulty levels doesn't engage me-- so if I wanted to try those games out I'd wait for a massive sale## and then purchase those games at the price that reflects the worth of a single playthrough rather than a steady stream of replays for.... whatever reason.
(I suspect that the "replay" concept of Diablo arose because people would replay the game while they waited for Diablo 3 and then Diablo 4 to be announced and released. Now, it's just... part of how the game is played.)
Nevertheless, when I watch Diablo 4 YouTube videos, what I'm struck by are how much Diablo 4 and World of Warcraft have blurred together, terminology wise. People talking about Affixes, grinding for Renown, and the various Seasons could be talking about either game, really. Add in World Bosses and dungeon grinding, and you'd have a hard time distinguishing discussions between the two games if you weren't looking at the screen.
We've all experienced this feeling before, which makes you wonder why you spent all this time in the first place. From Gamerant. |
Kind of like that ol' Diamond Flask for Warriors in WoW Classic. If you didn't know that was a BiS item for Warriors in Classic/Classic Era, and you missed out on selecting it as the reward from the Voodoo Feathers quest, then you were simply shit outta luck.
L2P noob indeed.
***
In the end, complexity is an aftereffect of how long a game has been in existence. All games will, over time, become more and more complex as additions are made to the base game. Hell, just look at all the additions to the various incarnations of Sid Meier's Civilization over the years. The thing is, just how the game implements that complexity and builds up to that complexity is critically important.
And that is something that Blizzard's properties need to work more extensively on.
*Such as, oh, 9 years from the date of this post but effectively 12 years.
**You can just opt out of this culture, as I kind of have, but that only goes so far. Even I partake in the min/max-ing culture whenever I fire up sixtyupgrades.com to see if a specific piece of gear is an upgrade or not. Still, Classic Era has been a true refuge from the meta driven culture found in Wrath Classic.
***They were most definitely old school in that they hated Star Trek: The Next Generation. I was the only one who regularly watched ST:TNG, and even then I stopped watching by my Junior year of college.
****I'm pretty sure I soloed Dar'Khan during the Cataclysm expansion on a Horde toon at level, and maybe even soloed the abominations as well.
*****I want to point out that membership in Aldor or Scryers was entirely optional in TBC. You'd think it was required, but I managed to simply ignore it on Deuce while leveling her and never had any issues with that. Of course, I wasn't going to raid, so that meant I wasn't gaining access to any Scryer or Aldor specific crafting recipes, but since I could just buy those if I needed them it wasn't a big deal per se. Flying in TBC wasn't mandatory if you weren't planning on raiding or accessing the Tempest Keep 5-person dungeons, as my old TBC Classic main --Briganaa-- didn't gain access to flying until some days after hitting max level and I absolutely was required to enter into those Tempest Keep instances for attunements. But Deuce, like before, skipped flying entirely until she finally had to bite the bullet and get it at L80 in Northrend. Now that I think about it, I'm pretty sure that Neve still doesn't have flying in Wrath Classic, and she's been at L80 for a long time now. It's... just not a priority for me in the same way that I don't have a single toon in the entirety of Wrath Classic that has epic flying. Somewhere I can hear the collective mass of Wrath players screaming at the audacity to simply not give a fuck about flying anywhere fast.
#I mean, good luck trying to get Diablo 1 to work, if you can find a (legal) copy at all.
##Oh, the irony. I wrote this over the weekend, and between then and now the Blizzard Summer Sale appeared, with D2: Resurrected at 67% off and the entire D3 franchise at 26% off. To be honest, I wasn't expecting this sale right now --more like in November/December-- and my budget is kind of shot to hell with car repairs and my oldest getting her wisdom teeth yanked, so I'll likely pass on D2.
Shadowlands is completely skippable nowadays, you can go straight from BfA to the Dragon Isles even as a new player. As a returning player you can just earn some XP in whatever way to get high enough for Dragonflight.
ReplyDeleteI generally agree that there's a bizarre amount of complexity in retail WoW, though Dragonflight has done a decent job at going back to the basics for some things at least.
I've never played a Diablo game but it's funny to me to see you claim that it's been influenced by WoW because I seem to remember reading that it was more the other way round, with concept like M+ being inspired by Diablo mechanics during Legion.
Also, Diablo 1 is available on Good Old Games as far as I'm aware.
I know that Shadowlands amped up the complexity to 11, but BfA had it's share of complexity spiking too, since it really began in Warlords of Draenor and Legion.
DeleteWhat I found funny was that after I created this post, one of the YouTubers I keep an eye on did a review of Diablo and mentioned the MMO-ification of Diablo 4 and questioned whether it was a good thing or not. So I must not be the only person who saw the convergence of mechanics in the two game franchises. In a way, this does make some sense from a "cost savings" standpoint, so that if the underlying mechanics --and associated code-- are similar enough, you can spend less money supporting both franchises. And with a similar code base for both games means that coders move between both franchises more easily when you need bodies for a development push. Now, I'm not saying that WoW's going to turn into an isometric view or anything, but if the design of the systems that drive both games are similar enough, that's less money to spend on "overhead" and more money in investors' pockets.
Most of the systems can be ignored if you just want to level and see all of the quests. Affixes are a Mythic+ only feature, so unless you want to chase gear you can ignore that. Renown comes naturally if you want to do the weekly quests. If you don't care about those story points or don't want to unlock stuff on renown vendors you can just ignore it, too. Mechanics aren't a big deal in heroics as folks tend to be geared enough now to move through them quickly (people tend to be doing their 5 heroics for the piece of weekly gear).
ReplyDeleteIn many ways Dragonflight is the most casual friendly version of Wow. Yeah, the earlier expansions had their complexity, but unless you opt to stay in them you generally aren't there long enough for any of it to matter. As is normal for Blizzard they really want you in the current expansion.
(Pallais, you kind of poked a scab, so this response has nothing to do with you at all, but something that I needed to unload. And yes, I've had similar discussions with my wife before, as you'll see at the end of this comment.)
DeleteRetail might be casual friendly, but leveling still seems so fast compared to Wrath Classic, let alone Vanilla Classic, that I'd essentially be done with an expac within a couple of weeks. That's not exactly a good way to spend $50 or whatever it costs on sale right now. By comparison, I play about 5 days/week on Classic Era about a total of 2-3 hours per day, and after 2 months of playing I've got one toon at L45, one at L26, and a couple of toons in the single digits. I don't expect to have my main at max level for another month or so, and even then I'll have plenty of time to just goof around on lower level toons. The entire leveling cadence on Retail seems so hyped up on amphetamines that you almost push yourself to go and do all these extra things without realizing it.
Think about all the stuff tossed your way in the few times I've poked my head into Retail: seed quest alerts pop up whenever I login on a Cataclysm or Mists era toon, and other alerts show up all over the damn place, asking "Hey, you want to do THIS?" "Do you want to do THAT?" "Do you want to level in STORMWIND?? We'll teleport you there!" It all feels like one of those phone calls that start with "Hello, is this Redbeard? I'd like to talk to you about the property at 1234 Mystreet Rd. Are you interested in selling your property?"
Dragonflight may be casual friendly compared to Warlords, Legion, BfA, and Shadowlands, but it's all in-your-face-all-the-time compared to Classic Era or even TBC Classic. (Admittedly with add-ons those two can become more Retail-like, but I've eschewed those add-ons as much as possible.) Sometimes you just want to login, sit on a bench somewhere, and watch the crowd go by. That concept of just doing nothing seems to be completely foreign to modern MMO design, where the game is designed to push all sorts of game directed play in your direction, casually oriented or not.
Even the design of quests themselves has changed greatly from Vanilla to Dragonflight, whereas is Vanilla you had to hunt around for quests in Dragonflight they foist them on you. It's akin to the differences between Elden Ring's organic quest design and the "modern" MMO design where all the quests are clearly marked and you're pointed in their direction.
This concept of just noodling around and doing nothing important is kind of the same argument I have with my wife on those few times we've been able to afford to go on vacation. She always feels like she has to be doing something, whereas I'm perfectly happy to just not do much of anything at all. Back in 1996, we went out to Denver so she could attend a convention she was presenting at, and before we left and on the drive out she kept telling me about all the things I could see and do in Denver. What did I do when we were out there? I drove out to a rest stop, parked, and with the mountains in the background I read a novel over the course of several days. And to me, it was fantastic.
I just don't think that modern MMOs are designed with me in mind, where it seems you actually have to work harder than you ought to just so you can do a whole lot of "not much".
If you decide to try out retail, let me know. We could try to get through old content together and Cat could take a spa break!
ReplyDeleteOr you could try Classic Era again, Ancient! I have enough gold (barely) that I can share with you which would help you out.
Delete